Amit shares the journey that brought him from analyst to senior identity leader at one of the largest banks in the U.S., highlighting the strategic decisions and mindset shifts that helped him scale IAM in complex environments. He explains how identity has become the new perimeter—and why enterprises must now account for AI agents alongside workforce and customer users. Throughout the episode, Amit emphasizes the importance of aligning IAM with business outcomes, from measuring ROI to mitigating fraud and reducing risk. He also offers candid advice for vendors, warning against broad, unfocused pitches and stressing the need to solve specific problems. With AI reshaping the security landscape and trust becoming harder to earn, Amit makes the case for visibility, accountability, and strategic alignment as the foundations of any successful identity program.
Disclaimer:
The views expressed in this episode are solely those of the guest and do not represent the opinions of their employer or family.
01:40 — The Origin Story: From business grad to identity leader at a major bank
12:00 — The Gauntlets: Implementing AI-proofing tools, measuring success, failure stories
26:44 — The Justice League:Collaborating across banking divisions to shape IAM strategy
32:54 — The Road Ahead: AI agents, automation, visibility and what’s next for IAM
Amit [0:00:00]: Ai is exploding right now.
Amit [0:00:01]: From a company or a corporate perspective, how do you make sure that you have visibility and accountability and some guard rails on what that Ai canon cannot do?
Mark [0:00:21]: Hey everyone.
Mark [0:00:22]: On this episode of the Identity Heroes Video cast.
Mark [0:00:24]: We are joined by Amit Vaidya.
Mark [0:00:26]: Amit shared with us some of the ways that his career has shaping developed over the years to becoming leading identity of one of the largest banks in the country.
Mark [0:00:34]: And along the way, he shared some of the tidbits about how to do more with the team that you have today the role that Ai agents are going to be playing in Ia am going forward and really it’s also for vendors.
Mark [0:00:46]: It’s a little bit of advice on what not to do when you were selling to major corporations.
Mark [0:00:51]: Let’s go ahead and listen to what Amit has to share now.
Mark [0:00:53]: Welcome to this episode of the Identity Heroes video cast.
Mark [0:00:57]: My co-host today is Gerry Gebel, and Gerry and I today are joined by Amit you, and we’re thrilled to have unit.
Mark [0:01:04]: This is…
Mark [0:01:04]: This is exciting.
Mark [0:01:05]: We’re…
Mark [0:01:05]: We had a chance to talk before, and we’re we’re thrilled to have you on the show with us today.
Amit [0:01:10]: Yeah.
Amit [0:01:10]: This super excited to be here.
Amit [0:01:11]: Thank you.
Gerry [0:01:13]: Yeah.
Gerry [0:01:13]: Thanks for joining us And met love…
Gerry [0:01:14]: Love it need to hear your story and, look forward to sharing it with the audience.
Mark [0:01:19]: Well for.
Mark [0:01:20]: The way that we’re gonna do this is We have a little bit of a structured here.
Mark [0:01:23]: So, That, we’ve we’ve identified you as one of the heroes in the identity industry.
Mark [0:01:28]: And our audience probably wants to know a bit of your background story.
Mark [0:01:32]: So just like as we think about any good superhero story or, like that hero’s arc, Everyone wants to know the origin story.
Mark [0:01:39]: What happened?
Mark [0:01:39]: Was it a radio spider?
Mark [0:01:41]: What did it?
Mark [0:01:41]: They they took you on this path.
Mark [0:01:43]: And I it maybe it was a radioactive spider.
Mark [0:01:46]: I don’t know.
Mark [0:01:47]: But I I
Amit [0:01:48]: wish it was that exciting, but
Mark [0:01:52]: Well, I’m gonna make it even easier and it will be a pretty exciting.
Mark [0:01:55]: Because what I like to do that that makes it easy for our guests to…
Mark [0:01:58]: Right.
Mark [0:01:58]: I know.
Mark [0:01:59]: I’m sorry, our audience to really kind of identify there’s not one true path to identity.
Mark [0:02:03]: Is, I actually got your Cv, and share that with me ahead of time.
Mark [0:02:06]: I appreciate it.
Mark [0:02:07]: And I’ve gone through and I’ve just taken out some of the job titles that you’ve had since you graduated.
Mark [0:02:12]: And I’m gonna read those in reverse order if that’s okay, and and we’ll kind of figure out Was this a linear path?
Mark [0:02:18]: Did you…
Mark [0:02:19]: Was the writing on the wall that you were headed to where you are today?
Mark [0:02:21]: Or maybe had some d details along the way.
Mark [0:02:23]: That’s cool.
Amit [0:02:24]: Yeah.
Amit [0:02:24]: Absolutely.
Mark [0:02:26]: Alright.
Mark [0:02:26]: So, Gerry, you ready for this.
Mark [0:02:27]: I’m gonna…
Mark [0:02:28]: I they I got the list going.
Mark [0:02:29]: And you’re ready?
Gerry [0:02:30]: Ready.
Gerry [0:02:30]: I’m I got my and then paper, I’m ready to go.
Mark [0:02:33]: Awesome.
Mark [0:02:33]: Alright.
Mark [0:02:34]: So Admit, as I was looking through your city, I just…
Mark [0:02:36]: I started pulling out again just the titles, and I’ve got you were an analyst for quite some time, then you became a a senior analyst, And this was after…
Mark [0:02:44]: I believe Graduate school that that you helped them.
Mark [0:02:47]: Undergrad.
Mark [0:02:48]: Okay.
Mark [0:02:48]: This is between undergrad and graduate school.
Mark [0:02:50]: Got it.
Mark [0:02:51]: And then you sort did this pivot into project management.
Mark [0:02:54]: And and the project management title actually took you into many program management.
Mark [0:02:59]: Positions.
Mark [0:03:00]: And it feels like you’ve really found a niche there.
Mark [0:03:03]: That was like, a, a fit through through many years.
Mark [0:03:06]: And then all the way up to, one of the largest banks in the country where you were the Sv of enterprise identity and data protection.
Mark [0:03:13]: And so, a a long journey, but in the same path, maybe this one was a little linear.
Mark [0:03:19]: What do what do you think?
Mark [0:03:19]: It?
Amit [0:03:21]: I would say, you know, project program management takes you in many different directions.
Amit [0:03:25]: Right?
Amit [0:03:26]: It could be anything from people process technology.
Amit [0:03:28]: My I will say, my expertise at my skill sets light, and how do I bring all three together?
Amit [0:03:36]: And that translated from It into security space.
Amit [0:03:41]: And that’s when it kinda took off in the last ten years.
Amit [0:03:45]: And then working within the security space, it then picked up within the identity access management space, and that’s when I was tapped to consolidate and bring together the enterprise identity together that focus on workforce customer and physical.
Amit [0:04:00]: So that’s how I ended up there.
Mark [0:04:03]: Got it.
Mark [0:04:04]: Well, you mentioned, you know, that that transition of the undergrad and graduate school, there’s really…
Mark [0:04:09]: We we tell our audience that there’s no defined degree for I am per s.
Mark [0:04:14]: However, you went one direction, and then you realized you wanted to go back to graduate school.
Mark [0:04:19]: What what took you from the analyst but going back to to business school.
Amit [0:04:22]: What and you know, thinking through where I was in my career.
Amit [0:04:27]: Right?
Amit [0:04:28]: I always wanted to learn more wanted to get more into the business side of things.
Amit [0:04:32]: Right?
Amit [0:04:32]: Because my my undergraduate degree was in business administration and minor and It, so I was able to kinda translate, you know, business into what the technical terms were.
Amit [0:04:42]: Right?
Amit [0:04:42]: Or technical requirements were, and vice versa.
Amit [0:04:44]: But I wanted to get more into understanding how budgets are formed.
Amit [0:04:50]: Right?
Amit [0:04:50]: How the financials work, how the long term strategies need to be…
Amit [0:04:55]: Right?
Amit [0:04:56]: So the framework that the graduate school gives you helps you helps elevate your understanding and how you start thinking about things.
Amit [0:05:04]: And that’s, you know, where that was something that I was craving as part of my growth, and so I decided to go join graduate school.
Amit [0:05:13]: And I I did it while I was working because was sponsored by the company I was working for.
Amit [0:05:19]: So That worked that
Mark [0:05:20]: was the best…
Mark [0:05:21]: If there’s a lesson to be learned here, that is best spread to a school to have.
Mark [0:05:24]: There’s one that was employer sponsors.
Mark [0:05:26]: And and so that really got you into that structured path, and then this very much into this program management that that that followed thereafter, which is really…
Mark [0:05:36]: I’m Gonna project here.
Mark [0:05:38]: Was it more of like a holistic look at, like, programs is like a business?
Amit [0:05:42]: Yeah.
Amit [0:05:42]: Essentially, what you’re looking at is running your own business where you’re making an investment, You’re getting an Roi?
Amit [0:05:49]: Right?
Amit [0:05:49]: And how are you reinvest that.
Amit [0:05:52]: Right?
Amit [0:05:53]: Or or are you able to apply in other different places?
Amit [0:05:55]: So that’s…
Amit [0:05:56]: That was the piece that really attracted me.
Amit [0:05:59]: And it helped me in my future career.
Amit [0:06:01]: It’s graduate school.
Gerry [0:06:03]: That’s that’s awesome.
Gerry [0:06:04]: Amit, I think it’s it’s so important to think about as we’re working on projects, you know, to implement technology or to, you know, address business needs or security and compliance that we’ve seen over and over again over the years is that good project and program management is so important to the overall success of the project.
Gerry [0:06:27]: Right?
Gerry [0:06:28]: It’s it’s not just…
Gerry [0:06:29]: I need to install this software, and I’ll see you later, but, you, connecting with stakeholders and it sounds like that’s really an incredible value that you bring, and I think that’s something that you the audience should also take in is that it’s not all about the technology, but there’s is this whole other aspect of a successful program that needs to be cared for.
Gerry [0:06:51]: So I think that’s super that you you bring that to the table.
Amit [0:06:55]: Yeah.
Amit [0:06:55]: And, you know, the…
Amit [0:06:57]: In every project or program that I’ve led.
Amit [0:07:00]: One of the most critical things have always been the focus on people process as it relates to technology.
Amit [0:07:07]: Right?
Amit [0:07:07]: If you if you bring in technology that the people don’t like or the processes can’t adjust, then, you know, it defeats the purpose.
Amit [0:07:16]: Right?
Amit [0:07:16]: So all those three, three components have to go hand in hand.
Mark [0:07:21]: I I think you’re actually just probably struck a chord with a lot of our audience because as we think about identity programs?
Mark [0:07:26]: A lot of times it’s like, oh, great.
Mark [0:07:28]: What…
Mark [0:07:28]: What is our team bringing to the rest of the organization again that they have to do or they have to adjust to.
Mark [0:07:33]: But maybe with the program side, do you have a way of communicating that a little differently or framing it?
Amit [0:07:40]: Even within the identity access management space, the approach that I took was what what is the business looking to solve?
Amit [0:07:48]: Right?
Amit [0:07:48]: And how can I enable it in a secure way?
Amit [0:07:52]: Right?
Amit [0:07:52]: So it was not, hey, this is what I bring to the table?
Amit [0:07:55]: This is what you have to do?
Amit [0:07:57]: It’s…
Amit [0:07:57]: What are you looking to do?
Amit [0:07:59]: And how can we allow you to do what you wanna do?
Amit [0:08:01]: Within our framework.
Amit [0:08:02]: So it’s done in a secure way.
Amit [0:08:05]: Right?
Amit [0:08:06]: Without compromising our security posture.
Amit [0:08:08]: So that was something…
Amit [0:08:10]: That was the approach we took and that helped me kinda drive a lot of the innovation and change within my last role.
Gerry [0:08:19]: Yeah.
Gerry [0:08:19]: And…
Gerry [0:08:19]: And Mark, I think another aspect of this is your understanding of the budget and the financials and putting together that story that, you know, tells a you know, a, pertinent and confident return on investment story, because you’re in internal competition, you know, with other projects for that funding.
Gerry [0:08:38]: Right?
Gerry [0:08:38]: So you you’ve you’ve really got to have your pitch down for for the execs and the stakeholders that are going to review and hopefully sign off on that project.
Amit [0:08:49]: Yes.
Amit [0:08:49]: And, you know, you, apart from the Roi and you know, the budget knowledge, you also have to understand risks.
Amit [0:08:56]: Right being in the security space, like, identity is a new perimeter.
Amit [0:08:59]: You don’t get that right, Everything else better be working as a secondary control.
Amit [0:09:03]: Right?
Amit [0:09:04]: So when I’m going up and pitching, hey, here’s what we need to do.
Amit [0:09:09]: Here’s what we need to accomplish this year.
Amit [0:09:10]: Right?
Amit [0:09:11]: I’ve laid out a roadmap of where we need to be And what can we realistically get done each year so that we can make that incremental progress?
Amit [0:09:20]: Right?
Amit [0:09:21]: And when I’m looking…
Amit [0:09:22]: When I’m structuring that, I’m looking at what is the largest risk that I need to solve for first?
Amit [0:09:28]: And then kind of build out from there.
Amit [0:09:30]: Right?
Amit [0:09:31]: So that that prioritization based on risk also goes a long way in how you structure and focus on what you need to accomplish each year.
Mark [0:09:42]: I’m hearing a little bit the that the B school communication track, but also comes into rest of being able to to frame these things in in a way that resonates that that, you, you know, you you have different alignment and different values across different parts of the organization.
Mark [0:09:55]: You gotta let them do what they wanna do, but make it seem like it was their idea as you’re bringing the thing to them.
Mark [0:10:01]: I do it agree.
Amit [0:10:03]: Yeah.
Amit [0:10:03]: And, you know, when you when you start having a cut risk based conversation.
Amit [0:10:08]: Right?
Amit [0:10:08]: At as an organization, because now you’re not just referring to one department within an organization.
Amit [0:10:14]: You’re looking at the holistic organization.
Amit [0:10:16]: Right?
Amit [0:10:16]: So the risk applies to the entire organization, not just one little group.
Amit [0:10:21]: That’s where it becomes a collective conversation.
Amit [0:10:24]: Right?
Amit [0:10:25]: And that’s where it did…
Amit [0:10:26]: It gets that proper weight in terms of discussion and how it competes with other priorities.
Amit [0:10:32]: So that was the approach I took and that worked, that worked well.
Amit [0:10:37]: In make making sure I had the right funding for the right projects, to move the needle forward in the identity journey.
Mark [0:10:45]: I think it, you know, and and then, you know, so…
Mark [0:10:47]: Before we get into your goal, let’s your challenges, the the the hurdles you overcame, if if you were to think about, like, that perfect business…
Mark [0:10:54]: I’m sorry, identity to.
Mark [0:10:56]: So in a high Am degree.
Mark [0:10:58]: If we were to just kinda put some core categories that would go into that curriculum, what…
Mark [0:11:03]: How might you frame what that would look like?
Mark [0:11:05]: You know, whether it was graduate school or not, just if it was just one lump degree?
Mark [0:11:08]: What what important thing to consider?
Amit [0:11:10]: I I think, you know, from an identity perspective, you have to think about, you know, how does it…
Amit [0:11:16]: How does identity access management work in a controlled space, like, a workforce identity, workforce I am.
Amit [0:11:23]: Right?
Amit [0:11:23]: And then you also have to teach folks, how does it work when it’s not controlled within the Science space.
Amit [0:11:29]: And, you know, moving forward, how is this going to impact when Ai comes into the mix.
Amit [0:11:37]: Right?
Amit [0:11:38]: You have now Ai agents that people are going to start leveraging to do things that they need to do?
Amit [0:11:45]: So how do all these three different categories work?
Amit [0:11:49]: And how do you how do you put the best practices is and what technology can be leveraged to secure your identity?
Amit [0:11:57]: And access management functions and the life cycle, that it needs to run through.
Amit [0:12:03]: So those are some key things I think, that should be included as part of core,
Gerry [0:12:10]: indeed.
Gerry [0:12:10]: Yeah.
Gerry [0:12:10]: And Mark.
Gerry [0:12:11]: I I don’t think we would have heard, I got any for agents a, a year ago.
Gerry [0:12:15]: Right?
Gerry [0:12:16]: Or even six months ago.
Gerry [0:12:17]: That’s this topic added to the curriculum,
Mark [0:12:20]: even six months ago.
Mark [0:12:21]: Even six months ago for sure.
Mark [0:12:22]: Well, you know, as as we’re, you know, Gerry is, we’re thinking through this and and and minute following your journey into some of the challenges.
Mark [0:12:30]: I know that you do a lot of advisory services now, and and you’re helping some startups and and and figure out their their paths and whatnot, As we think about failure, you know, failure kind of a loaded word, but sometimes failure can be a good thing because we learn from those moments, any any examples of you know, projects that maybe didn’t go as planned, but actually became a great learning experience or a pivot in your career.
Amit [0:12:52]: Yeah.
Amit [0:12:52]: You know, as we’re thinking you know, pivoting our identity journey.
Amit [0:12:58]: Right?
Amit [0:12:59]: Looking at the modern authentication mechanisms.
Amit [0:13:04]: Right?
Amit [0:13:04]: As we’re thinking about the f standards, how do we put in identity proofing as part of it?
Amit [0:13:11]: A couple of the products we brought in, thinking that that’s what, you know, was best of the breed at the time?
Amit [0:13:19]: But by the time we got the implementation, it was not the top product, and it didn’t yield the results we were looking for.
Amit [0:13:28]: But what it taught us was what should you be looking for?
Amit [0:13:35]: Right?
Amit [0:13:36]: It it it enhanced our understanding of what are we missing?
Amit [0:13:41]: What are we not getting?
Amit [0:13:42]: Yeah, that we needed to leverage to fight from?
Amit [0:13:45]: Right?
Amit [0:13:46]: So understanding that from a product that we implemented, but couldn’t quite get the desired results.
Amit [0:13:53]: Right?
Amit [0:13:53]: That failure of delivery is where we were able to learn from it and say, okay, I know exactly what I need now.
Amit [0:14:01]: And the next set of products we looked for.
Amit [0:14:04]: We made sure that those other check marks were hit, and how those companies were looking at the future.
Amit [0:14:10]: Right?
Amit [0:14:11]: As trends change as advancements happen, are those products keeping up with that.
Amit [0:14:17]: That was a key component that we missed in our first iteration, or the first product that we implemented.
Amit [0:14:23]: Right?
Amit [0:14:24]: Because the company was happy where they were, they weren’t innovating and keeping up with what the new trends were happening in the market, Right?
Amit [0:14:32]: Especially as you think about in Covid time, you know, digital transformation excel.
Amit [0:14:37]: Right?
Amit [0:14:37]: Ai as it started exploding on the scenes, you had a lot of deep fix that were coming out.
Amit [0:14:43]: So when you’re talking about identity proofing, are your tools that goal to detect some of the deep fakes and let you know that, hey, This is a fake.
Amit [0:14:53]: This is not a real person.
Amit [0:14:55]: So that was one of the key learnings that we got as part of our, you know, the product that we implemented that didn’t live up to its expectations.
Amit [0:15:05]: But we were able to come back very quickly find a different partner implemented and get it rolling.
Gerry [0:15:12]: And and identity proofing is one of those sort of, more difficult aspects of identity I think A really challenging one, especially when you think about the, you know, the ability to validate data across different jurisdictions, you know, that’s it’s very different as well.
Gerry [0:15:29]: So even.
Gerry [0:15:30]: Yeah.
Gerry [0:15:31]: I can I can see how that would have been a very challenging project?
Mark [0:15:34]: Yeah.
Mark [0:15:34]: And friction.
Mark [0:15:36]: You both have the benefits of…
Mark [0:15:37]: Oh, go ahead.
Amit [0:15:39]: No.
Amit [0:15:39]: Great.
Amit [0:15:39]: Finish it by.
Mark [0:15:41]: I I’m just thinking that you both actually have a unique background and that you both have shared banking experience in in in banking background, the jury you’ve a little bit as well.
Mark [0:15:50]: And and, you know, to degree, modern banking isn’t one of just walking into a branch.
Mark [0:15:54]: And finding the one that’s closest to you and having a relationship with the teller.
Mark [0:15:58]: It’s it’s a very thick business to a degree.
Mark [0:15:59]: It’s like, I can switch accounts so easily and so quickly from my phone if I wanted to.
Mark [0:16:04]: And so you need to reduce that friction as well throughout all this.
Mark [0:16:07]: And so all those security and risk things that we’re trying to balance have to be also commensurate with a smooth transaction, so you’re not scaring away, bank clients, you know, as you’re doing so.
Amit [0:16:20]: Right.
Amit [0:16:20]: And you know, if you don’t have
Gerry [0:16:23]: say that Bank has changed quite a lot since I’ve worked for a bank, Mark.
Amit [0:16:30]: And it’s an ever evolving space.
Amit [0:16:31]: Right?
Amit [0:16:32]: So There will be more changes that’ll come down the…
Amit [0:16:37]: Come come down the pike.
Mark [0:16:39]: Well, Gerry, I think you’re right.
Mark [0:16:40]: Like, obviously, banking can change a lot in in your time, and I don’t wanna…
Mark [0:16:43]: I wasn’t trying to, like, prove project there on on korea like throw anything along those lines, but nevertheless, it is something where, you know, the the the measurement of, like, success in a and especially in financial industry is is probably a lot different in other industries.
Mark [0:16:57]: So as, you know, Amit, as you’re thinking about what were the measures of success you know, maybe most recently at P c, but, like, just thinking through, like, the measure of success of of project for you.
Mark [0:17:06]: What were the Kpis?
Mark [0:17:07]: What were the goals?
Mark [0:17:08]: What were the things that you looked to as, a, a measure of success and as reported?
Amit [0:17:15]: So when we were looking at our measures of success, from a customer standpoint, Right?
Amit [0:17:20]: Or even from workforce standpoint.
Amit [0:17:21]: Can I get a modern authentication flow in with minimal friction, but still in a secure way?
Amit [0:17:29]: Right?
Amit [0:17:30]: So how many, what was the adoption percentage was one.
Amit [0:17:35]: The second aspect was, did we have any down downtime.
Amit [0:17:40]: Right?
Amit [0:17:41]: Where a customer or an employee was unable to get in?
Amit [0:17:45]: So those were a couple of the key ones that we were looking at, Right, how the availability was, you know, for the environment.
Amit [0:17:53]: And the third one was you know, through the new in new process flows that we put in place.
Amit [0:18:00]: What was the experience like?
Amit [0:18:02]: How did the customers perceive it?
Amit [0:18:05]: Right?
Amit [0:18:05]: So the…
Amit [0:18:06]: There’s that E ps score that the bank tracks?
Amit [0:18:09]: And that was something that we also looked at from a customer satisfaction perspective as well?
Mark [0:18:15]: Got it.
Mark [0:18:16]: You know, and and Gerry’s, we’re thinking it through the projects, you know, it it in your know, our home own career in our own place right now.
Mark [0:18:21]: I think a lot of us are just trying to figure out, what is that measure of success for I am, and it it it’s it it changes in it varies.
Mark [0:18:28]: And I think back to the communication aspect of the degree that we discuss.
Mark [0:18:31]: It’s it’s really understanding what matters to that particular department’s audience as you’re selling the value of project internally, you know,
Gerry [0:18:42]: Yeah.
Gerry [0:18:42]: That’s right.
Gerry [0:18:43]: And the, you know, the metrics are important.
Gerry [0:18:45]: So May, mentioned a couple ones that that are fairly concrete, you know, how how much adoption did you have of the advanced authentication.
Gerry [0:18:55]: But other one is a little bit softer.
Gerry [0:18:57]: Right?
Gerry [0:18:58]: It’s…
Gerry [0:18:58]: Well, what’s the experience?
Gerry [0:18:59]: Like, you know, have you put a score to that.
Gerry [0:19:02]: So some things are…
Gerry [0:19:03]: You know, the metrics are pretty hard and fast and clear, which is great.
Gerry [0:19:07]: But oftentimes we’re we’re trying to figure out, okay.
Gerry [0:19:09]: What’s the Ne number I can put to this, or the the real number I could put to this Ne kind of context or a concept and and sell that and also prove that the project is is being successful?
Amit [0:19:23]: Couple of additional pieces that we also tracked where, you know, what was our hit rate in terms of when we’re doing Id proofing or we catching fraud.
Amit [0:19:31]: Right.
Amit [0:19:31]: Which was the other part of it?
Amit [0:19:33]: And how much of it were we catching?
Amit [0:19:35]: Was anything in that, kinda got through.
Amit [0:19:37]: Right.
Amit [0:19:38]: So those are a couple other metrics that we were tracking in partnership with the fraud team.
Mark [0:19:43]: Sorry?
Mark [0:19:43]: Yeah.
Gerry [0:19:45]: Sorry to jump in Mark, But you you sparked an idea there admit.
Gerry [0:19:47]: And that is you know, I was at a I was at a Fintech conference last year.
Gerry [0:19:52]: And I’m, I’m wondering if that’s, like, a crossover point where identity people should be talking to, like, Fintech people because they’re concerned about fraud and really focused on identity proofing and and those sorts of things account take over and so on.
Gerry [0:20:08]: And it was real…
Gerry [0:20:10]: One thing that stood out to me was really…
Gerry [0:20:11]: It was really interesting just the vocabulary that they use.
Gerry [0:20:15]: I know if that’s been your experience as well.
Amit [0:20:18]: It absolutely is because at the end of the day, you’re trying to secure your customer’s assets.
Amit [0:20:23]: Right?
Amit [0:20:24]: And their transactions.
Amit [0:20:24]: So identity, again, is the new perimeter that you have to get it right.
Amit [0:20:29]: Right?
Amit [0:20:30]: So whether you’re on Fintech or banking, at the underlying level, you’re still trying to secure a customer.
Amit [0:20:36]: So, yes, it absolutely applies because the impact of fraud in either one is very real.
Amit [0:20:44]: Right.
Amit [0:20:45]: It can also take a reputation hit, which is even larger than the a financial loss.
Mark [0:20:51]: So…
Mark [0:20:51]: Well our our personal finances are probably one of our just most sacred things that the you know, that…
Mark [0:20:57]: Like, it’s one of the most emotional things, probably too.
Mark [0:20:59]: So that, a amidst step there by a financial institution, you know, obviously, is is great risk both in as you mentioned, reputation, but also just for losing clients that would bounce to another, another group.
Mark [0:21:12]: Any thoughts, I mean, you know, and as you were thinking through at P and C about the security features.
Mark [0:21:18]: As we think about banking, you probably had very wide generation of of clients of banking customer.
Mark [0:21:23]: So if you had, like, the digital natives who you know, or to tiktok everything is very fluid, and they get it, and it’s very easy, So Id proofing and verification, make a lot of sense, and then you have the other end inspector.
Mark [0:21:32]: My parents who wouldn’t feel really comfortable with some of these tools.
Mark [0:21:35]: How you find the balance between that and the risk.
Amit [0:21:39]: Well, so we we really had to make sure that we had products that support all, you know, customers from all different walks of life.
Amit [0:21:47]: Right?
Amit [0:21:48]: But our goal was to educate the ones that were on the less secure spectrum, so that we can start moving them to more modern, way of authenticating.
Amit [0:22:00]: Right?
Amit [0:22:01]: Again, within their comfort zone, but at some point, I have to start eliminating my weakest points.
Amit [0:22:06]: Right?
Amit [0:22:07]: And still continue to support the customer whether transitioning them to voice authentication or, you know, some other form, right, where they’re still comfortable.
Amit [0:22:17]: And You know, if it’s the they just feel comfortable saying with user id password, you know, hey, I’m going to send you a text message that’s going to have a Mfa code.
Amit [0:22:28]: Right?
Amit [0:22:29]: That we’re going to use every single time.
Amit [0:22:31]: That’s a bare minimum that has to happen.
Amit [0:22:33]: If you’re not comfortable with the fingerprints and the, Id proofing components.
Amit [0:22:39]: Right?
Amit [0:22:40]: So we were working to continuously educate and elevate their experience Right?
Amit [0:22:46]: While making sure we’re continuing to maintain our security posture.
Mark [0:22:50]: Well, I love the failure story.
Mark [0:22:52]: I love the the spinning into the positive light, like, you know, how this all came together.
Mark [0:22:55]: Now I’m guessing a lot of those services are third party vendor services that you view brought in.
Mark [0:23:00]: I’m sure part of our audience is also on the vendor side.
Mark [0:23:04]: Any tragic mistakes or reports of wisdom that you can give vendors as they’re selling products into organizations like like Fancy?
Amit [0:23:13]: Many.
Amit [0:23:13]: I mean, I’ve had vendors who come in, you know, promising the moon, but when you look at their product, you know, it delivers maybe not even getting up to the edge of the space.
Amit [0:23:29]: Right?
Amit [0:23:30]: To you know, vendors who come in for one purpose, but they’re kinda throwing everything they have out there instead of that purpose that they came in to have the conversation with.
Amit [0:23:40]: So, you know, know what you’re selling.
Amit [0:23:43]: Right?
Amit [0:23:43]: Come in to talk about what you wanna talk about and not just throw everything including the kitchen sink in the conversation.
Amit [0:23:50]: And have a focused conversation on what the pain points are and, you know, how do you help solve that?
Amit [0:23:56]: Right?
Amit [0:23:57]: Partner with the customer on what it is that they’re looking to solve, not just try to sell them everything you have.
Amit [0:24:05]: I would say it would be a key, message to the vendor community.
Gerry [0:24:10]: Sounds like good advice, Mark.
Gerry [0:24:11]: Those points.
Gerry [0:24:12]: And now also that sounds like would lead to a much more productive conversation it as well.
Amit [0:24:18]: Yes.
Amit [0:24:18]: Absolutely.
Amit [0:24:18]: Because, you know, time is precious on both ends.
Amit [0:24:21]: Right?
Amit [0:24:22]: It’s not one is more precious versus the other.
Amit [0:24:25]: So make making the best use of that time, to have a productive conversation goes a long way.
Mark [0:24:31]: So a lot of respect for being able for a person who might actually say the boundaries of what the product doesn’t do.
Mark [0:24:36]: And and I clearly say, I’m glad we have this time together, but that’s not something we can view to not waste time either way.
Mark [0:24:43]: Yeah.
Mark [0:24:43]: Makes good sense.
Mark [0:24:46]: It makes good sense.
Mark [0:24:47]: Well, you know, thinking back to, on the program management side and think but kind of a little bit to b school hat on.
Mark [0:24:52]: You know, as you’re thinking to collaboration with other departments and as you’re doing this.
Mark [0:24:56]: In any words of wisdom of, like, hot questioning or how you engage with various teams to find out what does matter to them to tell that right story?
Amit [0:25:05]: What?
Amit [0:25:05]: You the the one thing that worked for me.
Amit [0:25:10]: I was say, initially, you know, I came in.
Amit [0:25:14]: I’m like, hey, I need…
Amit [0:25:15]: I’m charged to turn this thing around and to modernize identity and access management.
Amit [0:25:20]: Here’s my path I’m gonna layout out.
Amit [0:25:23]: But as I started showcasing that that road roadmap on what we’re looking to do and what our end stage needs to be.
Amit [0:25:30]: I had a lot of people raising their hands going, this may not work for our business model.
Amit [0:25:35]: Right?
Amit [0:25:37]: That’s when I realized you know, this is going to be my next step, which is engaging with the stakeholders to say, okay, here’s my initial thought on where we need to be.
Amit [0:25:48]: What works what doesn’t work for you.
Amit [0:25:50]: Right?
Amit [0:25:51]: Having that conversation really help kinda elevate our road roadmap and our final destination, our North star where we wanted it to be.
Amit [0:26:01]: Because it gave us a good understanding of what are the different stakeholders.
Amit [0:26:05]: Right?
Amit [0:26:06]: Because your stakeholders who serve retail clients.
Amit [0:26:08]: Right?
Amit [0:26:09]: Consumers, individual consumers versus a corporate client are different.
Amit [0:26:12]: Right?
Amit [0:26:13]: What they’re looking for is different versus what you know, a wealth management client is looking…
Amit [0:26:19]: Like, a wealth management business is looking for is completely different.
Amit [0:26:22]: So how do we take into account all their requirements come up with a standardized way but a range of different things that they can do so we can support everybody’s requirements.
Amit [0:26:35]: Right?
Amit [0:26:36]: And that helped reshape our overall map and what capabilities we needed to bring to the table.
Amit [0:26:42]: For a successful rollout.
Amit [0:26:45]: Well mark,
Gerry [0:26:46]: that that certainly resonates with some of my experiences as well, you think of a a financial institution as sort of a monolithic thing, but no.
Gerry [0:26:55]: There’s extremely diverse business units in there.
Gerry [0:26:58]: So, yeah, And then I can see the challenge are trying to meet the…
Gerry [0:27:02]: All those varied requirements in a cohesive way.
Gerry [0:27:05]: Yeah.
Gerry [0:27:05]: That’s quite a challenge.
Amit [0:27:06]: And, you know, experience matter Right?
Amit [0:27:08]: Customer experience matters.
Amit [0:27:10]: Right?
Amit [0:27:10]: In this space.
Amit [0:27:11]: So as I mentioned, we look at the E p scores.
Amit [0:27:14]: Right?
Amit [0:27:15]: This is where we’re looking at, you know, what a retail customer score might b might be different from what a corporate customer’s score would be.
Amit [0:27:23]: Because what we heard from our stakeholders was, they don’t want the same experience that a retail person has on the corporate level.
Amit [0:27:32]: They wanted slightly elevated.
Amit [0:27:33]: Right?
Amit [0:27:35]: So, you know, finding what that elevation looks like and still meeting our security requirements.
Amit [0:27:40]: That was the key.
Mark [0:27:44]: Almost feels like a place where you could use identity as a strategic differentiator, and and, like, for the wealth management side, making it feel like that secured experience of the movies where there’s triple locks and wait, there’s another lock behind the lock and and just making people feel Let me, know part of the marketing a little bit too.
Mark [0:27:59]: But for.
Amit [0:28:02]: You can monetize some of that.
Amit [0:28:03]: Right?
Amit [0:28:03]: If you think about it.
Amit [0:28:05]: Right?
Amit [0:28:05]: If I give you an exclusive card that has a it it’s it’s kinda like the Ubi key, but it’s in a card format.
Amit [0:28:13]: They’re have to tap it every time you need it along with your fingerprint.
Amit [0:28:17]: Right now you have multi factor enabled right there.
Amit [0:28:21]: So how do you…
Amit [0:28:23]: Like, can you monetize something like that?
Amit [0:28:26]: Right?
Amit [0:28:26]: Because it’s an exclusive, it’s an…
Amit [0:28:29]: It’s a very exclusive offering that you don’t get in most of the banks.
Amit [0:28:33]: Right?
Amit [0:28:34]: And I’m not saying necessarily a U key, but something similar where there’s a, you know, second factor, that’s available that you can tap that’s only you assigned to you.
Amit [0:28:46]: And that’s produced that’s hand it out by the bank and not necessarily procured anywhere.
Amit [0:28:53]: Right?
Amit [0:28:54]: So it offers that secure element that is very specific to that bank.
Mark [0:28:59]: Okay Okay.
Mark [0:28:59]: I think that’s great.
Mark [0:29:00]: Know, and I mean, if it…
Mark [0:29:01]: May I’ve never owned one build, like the black cards and, like, global services with you united.
Mark [0:29:06]: And there’s all these reason that that elevated thing can have that high touch experience that, you know, it is expected, and it’s it’s interesting to think about how you’d monetize that.
Mark [0:29:15]: You know.
Mark [0:29:15]: So one thing that I know that doesn’t change, and I’m assuming probably hadn’t in your career is that you didn’t have unlimited budget to do all these things.
Mark [0:29:23]: That it there was always a constraint of having to prioritize and and pick to do what.
Mark [0:29:28]: Any thoughts about how you did more with the team you had or the resources that you had to to punch about the weight wait so to speak.
Amit [0:29:36]: Yeah.
Amit [0:29:36]: And when we looked at, you know, our overall identity access management program?
Amit [0:29:40]: Right?
Amit [0:29:41]: We’re not only looking at how to modernize, but how do we make our own processes is more efficient.
Amit [0:29:46]: Right?
Amit [0:29:47]: How can I remove the human the the task that took the longest?
Amit [0:29:53]: Right?
Amit [0:29:54]: Can I automate it?
Amit [0:29:55]: Right?
Amit [0:29:55]: And can I reuse that individual to do something different, something more meaningful?
Amit [0:29:59]: Right?
Amit [0:30:00]: So that was always one of the things that we looked at, whether it’s, you know, automating not directory aware applications.
Amit [0:30:09]: Right?
Amit [0:30:10]: And managing their access certification life cycles.
Amit [0:30:13]: If I can automate that and reduce that by thirty percent now I need thirty percent less resources on that function.
Amit [0:30:20]: I can use them to do something else.
Amit [0:30:23]: Right, I can use them to learn a new product that we’re trying to bring up.
Amit [0:30:27]: So those were, the different areas that we looked at from an operational perspective, and we were able to apply some of that.
Amit [0:30:39]: And meet most of the resources we have.
Mark [0:30:43]: Know that.
Mark [0:30:43]: And and even Gerry, as you mentioned the start of this, the the conversation around agent support to a agent, you know, authentication…
Mark [0:30:51]: Authentication…
Mark [0:30:52]: Automation.
Mark [0:30:53]: I should’ve have said, wasn’t even in a conversation for Us ago.
Mark [0:30:56]: And, like, who knows what we’re gonna be doing four months from now that that automate things even further to to do so.
Gerry [0:31:03]: Yeah.
Gerry [0:31:03]: That…
Gerry [0:31:04]: That’s right.
Gerry [0:31:04]: I mean, that’s one of the promises of, of, you know, Ai is that it can make us more efficient or much more so.
Gerry [0:31:11]: And so we can do more with less or do more with the same people that we have today.
Gerry [0:31:16]: So that’s that’s part of the promise.
Mark [0:31:18]: Yeah.
Mark [0:31:18]: No.
Mark [0:31:19]: Thinking about that.
Mark [0:31:20]: I know we’re…
Mark [0:31:20]: I wanna put words in your mouth.
Mark [0:31:22]: We just mentioned agent Ai.
Mark [0:31:23]: What’s an area that you are looking and learning up on, you know, reading up on yourself to to further your knowledge base.
Amit [0:31:30]: Well, this is actually one of the biggest areas right, to study right now, which is Ai is exploding right now.
Amit [0:31:38]: Right?
Amit [0:31:38]: Outside of the chat, Jp, how are people leveraging Ai to make their day to day more easier, right?
Amit [0:31:48]: More efficient.
Amit [0:31:49]: And how do you enable that Ai agents to allow people to do more.
Amit [0:31:56]: But from a company or a corporate perspective or enterprise perspective, how do you make sure that you have visibility and accountability and some guard rails around on what that Ai can cannot do.
Amit [0:32:09]: Right?
Amit [0:32:10]: So that’s the part that I’m kinda interested in reading up on and, you know, there’s so much research and so much development happening in that space.
Amit [0:32:20]: Right?
Amit [0:32:20]: And a lot of new companies are coming up with different ways of putting those guard rails.
Amit [0:32:25]: So that’s the the next big thing that I’m kinda setting up on right now.
Amit [0:32:30]: Yeah.
Gerry [0:32:30]: Nit that was the topic of a lot of side conversations at the recent ide conference as well.
Gerry [0:32:37]: There’s definitely a lot of people thinking about this, sharing ideas out in the open whether it’s at a conference like that or on Linkedin.
Gerry [0:32:44]: They say a lot of let a good dialogue going on out there on this topic.
Gerry [0:32:48]: So, yeah, It’s super interesting to follow right now.
Mark [0:32:51]: That’s a great point, Gerry.
Mark [0:32:52]: You know, like Linkedin and what we’re not matt, is there anything on your side where you’re finding good resources that, you know, our audience might also think to look for research.
Amit [0:33:01]: I would say…
Amit [0:33:01]: I mean, outside of Linkedin, you know, there are many podcast who are talking about it.
Amit [0:33:06]: Right?
Amit [0:33:06]: Cs is one of the ones that I usually listen to.
Amit [0:33:10]: They have some good content every now and then.
Amit [0:33:12]: But just keeping track of the news, right, because a lot of companies are coming out and announcing things whether they’re on Linkedin or outside of Linkedin.
Amit [0:33:20]: Right?
Amit [0:33:21]: There are a lot of technology magazines, you know, or different online portal that will also report on this…
Amit [0:33:28]: The advancements in this space.
Amit [0:33:30]: So Just keeping track of that through, you know, my Google feed, and Google is good about feeding here that kind of information as Jump.
Mark [0:33:41]: The robots are telling us which robots…
Mark [0:33:42]: Yeah.
Mark [0:33:43]: It it becomes very…
Mark [0:33:44]: Yeah, all the way there’s comes together, but that…
Mark [0:33:46]: That’s awesome.
Mark [0:33:46]: Well, I I have a hunch when we recon being probably in a year’s time.
Mark [0:33:49]: Like, we won’t even won’t even imagine, like, it came mind with the world’s gonna be like at that point.
Mark [0:33:54]: When we versus what we’re talking about here on the the show today.
Mark [0:33:57]: But this is awesome.
Mark [0:34:00]: I mean, you’ve you’ve done so many different things you’ve like gotten so high you’ve done so well in your career.
Mark [0:34:05]: Any final words of wisdom for, the audiences they’re thinking about, like, Did I do the right thing or study the right thing in school or am I doing the right job right now and I am?
Mark [0:34:14]: Any closing thoughts?
Amit [0:34:16]: I I would say in adult stress.
Amit [0:34:17]: Right?
Amit [0:34:18]: But keep yourself open to learning and talk to one another Right?
Amit [0:34:23]: There are so many other I professionals in the industry.
Amit [0:34:26]: And people are more than happy to talk about you know, what are some of the best practices that you should be looking at, even if you’re not doing it?
Amit [0:34:35]: Right?
Amit [0:34:36]: One of the things that someone posted, earlier on Linkedin was, like, I was just reading at earlier today was, you know, if you think, like, if you look around, you think there are so many mature I programs they’re not.
Amit [0:34:50]: Everyone feels like, hey, there’s so much more I could be doing?
Amit [0:34:54]: Right?
Amit [0:34:55]: But it…
Amit [0:34:57]: But the important aspect is people are now starting to have conversations with each other To say hey, what are you doing?
Amit [0:35:03]: Can I do something differently than what I am today?
Amit [0:35:06]: Right?
Amit [0:35:07]: Doing more with less?
Amit [0:35:08]: Right?
Amit [0:35:09]: How do I pivot and bring…
Amit [0:35:12]: Do more with the less number of resources that I have?
Amit [0:35:15]: And that is driving a lot of collaboration and idea sharing that people are able to leverage to move the needle.
Mark [0:35:25]: Brother.
Mark [0:35:25]: Yeah.
Mark [0:35:26]: Don’t they’ll be afraid to ask.
Mark [0:35:27]: Right?
Mark [0:35:28]: You’re.
Mark [0:35:28]: I mean, Go on Linkedin ask, you know, if someone might see Might too far up.
Mark [0:35:32]: But I think a lot of very senior people like yourself.
Mark [0:35:35]: You you enjoy hearing that.
Mark [0:35:36]: Maybe even providing mentorship, now not trying to put you on the spot there, but don’t be afraid to ask, Like, find those paths.
Amit [0:35:43]: And, you know, the one thing I will say, I’ve joined many groups where people freely discuss these kind of ideas.
Amit [0:35:49]: Right?
Amit [0:35:50]: And the whole purpose of their group is to share ideas and knowledge so that people can learn from each other.
Gerry [0:35:56]: Well, I I think that’s great And admit you’ve shared so much that I think our audience is going to learn from today.
Gerry [0:36:02]: But and speaking of these other people and these other groups, I mean, who is out there that you would recommend that Mark and I should interview and and have on the show for a future recording.
Amit [0:36:13]: Absolutely.
Amit [0:36:13]: I…
Amit [0:36:13]: You know, one of the people I had interviewed and I wasn’t able to bring him on board to my team in the past, and he’s doing really good work.
Amit [0:36:22]: Is, He’s…
Amit [0:36:26]: You can find him on Linkedin.
Amit [0:36:28]: I’ll I’ll send you his, name in his Linkedin, his Linkedin profile.
Amit [0:36:34]: But he also hosts a podcast podcasts.
Amit [0:36:37]: He talks a lot about.
Amit [0:36:38]: I am…
Amit [0:36:39]: And it’s really good to see a lot of the content and the dialogue that that generates.
Gerry [0:36:44]: That’s awesome.
Gerry [0:36:44]: That’s a great recommendation.
Gerry [0:36:45]: Thanks for that.
Mark [0:36:47]: Well, you know, we we we’ve talked about breaking on the silos of by.
Mark [0:36:49]: I think we’re breaking out the silos of competitiveness too.
Mark [0:36:52]: There’s just so much of a great community around I am right now that we’re all supporting each other to to to do these things together.
Mark [0:36:59]: So a lot of recommendation we’ll certainly reach out to.
Mark [0:37:02]: Well Amit, thank you so much for joining us today.
Mark [0:37:04]: This was great.
Amit [0:37:06]: Hey, Mark and Gerry.
Amit [0:37:06]: Thank you for having me.
Amit [0:37:07]: I really appreciate it.
Gerry [0:37:09]: Thank you as well.
Gerry [0:37:10]: It’s it’s great.
Gerry [0:37:11]: It’s great to have you here.
Gerry [0:37:12]: Thank you.
Mark [0:37:13]: Gerry.
Mark [0:37:13]: Thanks as Always and for our audience.
Mark [0:37:14]: Thanks for spending your time with us.
Mark [0:37:16]: Be sure to check out the channel for other episodes, and we hope to see you again soon.
Mark [0:37:19]: Thanks.
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